Mac Forum / Applications / MS Office / September 2005

       Hi Loren,

I read the board almost daily (if not more than once a day) and I still
say the same thing:
- I've read hundreds of posts mentioning Office refusing to startup
because of fonts or font cache corruption
- I don't remember people with *recurrent* font or font cache corruption
issues.

Hum... you are talking about the System font cache. I am talking about
the Office font cache (the one in ~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/).
That's quite different. Trashing the System font cache won't fix the
problem most of the time.

I guess I should have been more clear. When I said "what font problem" I
should have said:
"I don't know of any recurring font problem with Office if the Fonts are
not corrupted and if the Office Font cache has been porperly cleaned-up:
what other known font problem are you referring to?"
I
understand that the orinal phrasing of my post could have seemed a
little abrupt, but that's clearly not what I intended. I sure didn't
mean "doh" but instead "please elaborate because I don't know how to
address your question unless you give us more details".

None of us in the newsgroup are in the position to fix any of these
problems. All you'll find here are people who might know a workaround or
a simple fix allowing you to get the app up and running.

I did. I can't find refeerences to a recurring font problem that would
come back by itself once the onriginal issue has been adressed as
suggested on the board.

I can try to assume you are talking about the Office font cache issue.
Then if you quit all Office app (Entourage could still run even though
the other apps won't launch) and then trash
~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Office Font Cache (11) (~/ represents
your user folder), can you launch Word and does the problem ever come
back ??
If it does come back, is your user folder located outside the boot
partition on your Mac?

If your fonts or font cache are corrupted, there is no way a new update
will fix the problem (unless the installer takes it upon itself to
perform some cleaniup and trash the previous cache).

For information, here is what I know of font issues that make Office act
funky:
- corrupted Fonts: this is a system-wide problem that can also affect
other apps than Office. Many apps won't care, but some other apps might
crash or hang or display glitches ontheir documents. There are many
methods to find out what font (in the many active font directories
recognized by the system) are corrupted. The easiest being using a Font
Utility like FontDoctor. You usually cannot fix corrupted fonts and they
have to be either trashed or reinstalled.

- corrupted MacOS X font cache at the system or user level: this will
also affect many apps. Cleaning up the mess manually is rather tedious
but hopefully there are several utilities outthere that do it all for
you in a flash. Rebooting right after trashing the font cache is
mandatory (even though some of the utilities don't mention it). The best
utiilties either force you to reboot once they're done, or move the
cache to the trash without emptying it and then ask you to reboot.

- corrupted Office Font cache: This is the one I mentioned here. I don't
know what corrupts it, but cleaning it up is fairly easy.

All three problems have been reported numerous time in the group indeed.
If cleaned up properly, they should not come backjust like that (and I
haven't read any report indicating that they did come back if they were
properly cleaned - which, with the second problem listed is not always
trivial).
The first two are system-wide problems not induced by Office (but that
greatly affect Word Excel and PowerPoint).
None of these problems are usually adressed in any update of any kind
(Apple or MS) since they are related to file corruption and beyond the
scope of any update. If the problem was recurring and caused
systematically by the System or Office, then I would agree that an
update might address the problem for good, but so far I haven't seen any
evidence for that.

Now Loren (and I don't mean "doh"): is the problem you are talking about
one of the three I listed or is it different ?? Does it come back once
proper cleanup has been performed ??

Corentin

??? I've read through threads and haven't seen enough information
presented to constitute demonstrable evidence that this is true, though
it is likely, IMO.

Perhaps, perhaps not. Serendipity happens, but you can't be sure it will
be any more successful than carefully controlled experimentation. It
could just as easily lead to utter confusion unless everything about the
systems that report is known. There's no guarantee that examining a file
will tell you what caused its corruption, any more than examining a
puddle of water will tell you what shape the ice sculpture was before it
melted. You're using magical thinking, here.

Don't see any evidence this is anything other than just your assertion.
I didn't see any reports of stock Tiger installs with only Office loaded
displaying the problem. Perhaps I missed them.

You can't even begin to know that. Repeated assertion doesn't make it so.

That's likely true. It's millions of lines of code originating 20 years
ago. That alone may prevent dealing with a problem. But if you wish to
have Office on the Mac, that's one of the realities that has to be dealt
with.

What does your cost have to do with anything? It launches for the vast
majority of thousands of users. That means your system is unusual, even
if others share that difference. Technically, MacBU has zero liability
for that, other than to allow you to return it for a refund if it
doesn't work. If enough users have the problem, it has both a business
and a PR incentive to get the problem fixed, regardless of whose fault
it is.

But MS is a business. MacBU is required to conform to MS business
practices. If that means choosing not to spend a dollar to chase a
nickel, that's what they'll choose. To do anything else is a waste of
their shareholders' resources.

In what other industry is a company *required* to invest substantial
amounts in researching a problem experienced by a small number of
customers, especially when the problem only manifests itself with, and
may be caused by, another manufacturer's product?

Your desire to get a permanent fix is understandable. So is your
frustration. Your indignation, however, is misplaced.

I'm hardly being an apologist - I've acknowledged that this could be
MS's problem and it could be easy to fix. I rather pointed out that your
statements were emotional rather than based on facts in evidence, and
that your expectations were not necessarily realistic. But to prevent
further incidents of illness:

   <plonk!>