 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Mac Forum / Country Specific / UK Mac Group / May 2008A reminder why I prefer Macs
Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. 10:00 today: broke the seals and started unpacking. 19:00 today: finally got it into a usable state. XP Pro updated as far as it will go, Office 2007 installed and upgraded, Project and Visio installed, Skype installed, Outlook linked to the Exchange server. That's it... a full working day to get a computer into a state where I can *start* using it! Incredible... That aside, it's got a nice 20" Dell screen and a horrible 'faux-Apple' white and silver case. Cute little 'mini-keyboard', 4gb RAM and 250gb HDD - and all for £400. If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( > Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I > wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( Yeah but......if MS DID give us Project & Visio (and a fully functional Exchange client for that matter), then nobody would need to buy Windows any more.... Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. On Wed, 7 May 2008 23:25:15 +0100, adm wrote >> If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I >> wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( > > Yeah but......if MS DID give us Project & Visio (and a fully functional > Exchange client for that matter), then nobody would need to buy Windows > any more.... Exactly... As I have just proven :-( [snip] > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. He's also not running MS. Rowland.  SignatureRemove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell@dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking > [snip] > > > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. > > He's also not running MS. Don't you believe it. I know he's supposed to be handing his keys over fully somewhere in 2009, but with the recent Yahoo! fiasco I have to wonder if he's thinking "Balmer's not up to it" and may hang around a wee bit longer. Jim Signature'Cloverfield' in nine words: "What is it?!" "We're gonna die!" BOOM! Roll credits. Find me at http://www.ursaminorbeta.co.uk On Thu, 8 May 2008 06:10:27 +0100, Jim wrote >>> Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > wonder if he's thinking "Balmer's not up to it" and may hang around a > wee bit longer. But, from Microsoft's POV, has the Yahoo thing been a fiasco? So far it's brought down the value of Yahoo and put Jerry Yang on the back foot. Even though Yang wants to walk away from the deal, his shareholders are meeting next week (?) and will be roasting him. Result that is Yang EITHER bites the bullet and talks to Ballmer again (at a lower asking price) OR Yang walks and MS starts negotiating with his successor. None of which means Ballmer is *necessarily* a genius but I suspect, when the dust settles, he might come out of this smelling of roses > On Thu, 8 May 2008 06:10:27 +0100, Jim wrote >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > But, from Microsoft's POV, has the Yahoo thing been a fiasco? So far it's > brought down the value of Yahoo and put Jerry Yang on the back foot. I'm _fairly_ sure that Yahoo!'s share price was just under $20 before this. It's currently $25. > Even though Yang wants to walk away from the deal, his shareholders are > meeting next week (?) and will be roasting him. Aye, there could be recriminations there. > Result that is Yang EITHER bites the bullet and talks to Ballmer again (at a > lower asking price) OR Yang walks and MS starts negotiating with his > successor. Or he (Yang) just weathers it. Which is what I think will happen. > None of which means Ballmer is *necessarily* a genius but I suspect, when the > dust settles, he might come out of this smelling of roses I still think it makes him look like a ditherer. And as one of the MacBreak guys said, "if you tie two turkeys together you don't get an eagle". Jim Signaturehttp://www.ursaMinorBeta.co.uk http://twitter.com/GreyAreaUK "Don't you *dare* use the word 'party' as a verb in this shop!" -- Bernard Black, 'Black Books' > > [snip] > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Don't you believe it. I know he's supposed to be handing his keys over > fully somewhere in 2009 June this year he stands down and he repeated it a couple of days ago. He agreed with balmer. >, but with the recent Yahoo! fiasco I have to > wonder if he's thinking "Balmer's not up to it" and may hang around a > wee bit longer. Hardly a fiasco for microsoft - their share price is up, yahoos is down. A years time they can walk in and do a hostile takeover at half the price. Doubt it. I think he wants to go. But hey, it is a long time since microsoft hit a target! SignatureWoody www.alienrat.com >> > > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. >> > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > June this year he stands down and he repeated it a couple of days ago. > He agreed with balmer. Ah, fair enough. I'll still believe it when I see it, mind :-) >>, but with the recent Yahoo! fiasco I have to >> wonder if he's thinking "Balmer's not up to it" and may hang around a >> wee bit longer. > > Hardly a fiasco for microsoft - their share price is up, yahoos is down. You're the second person to say this - I _though_ Yahoo!'s stock price was just under $20 before all this - have I got that wrong? > A years time they can walk in and do a hostile takeover at half the > price. I think it would need to be less than a year - a year gives the stock time to recover. Besides, I'm not sure they _want_ to do a hostile takeover. If they do that they stand to lose what they're trying to buy - the skillset. I can't explain why but I feel that more people will leave as the result of a hostile bit than would if it was a friendly one. > Doubt it. I think he wants to go. But hey, it is a long time since > microsoft hit a target! True, but I suspect you're right - he wants out. Jim Signaturehttp://www.ursaMinorBeta.co.uk http://twitter.com/GreyAreaUK "Don't you *dare* use the word 'party' as a verb in this shop!" -- Bernard Black, 'Black Books' > >> > > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. > >> > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > You're the second person to say this - I _though_ Yahoo!'s stock price was > just under $20 before all this - have I got that wrong? No, I guess I have! I heard it was down, I didn't look. > > A years time they can walk in and do a hostile takeover at half the > > price. > > I think it would need to be less than a year - a year gives the stock time > to recover. I don't mean necessarily from this. I mean in general - yahoo is not a real provider of much that makes money, and there is a recession on. > Besides, I'm not sure they _want_ to do a hostile takeover. If > they do that they stand to lose what they're trying to buy - the skillset. I > can't explain why but I feel that more people will leave as the result of a > hostile bit than would if it was a friendly one. I would assume so. There is also the scortched earth thing they promised. SignatureWoody www.alienrat.com <snip> > Hardly a fiasco for microsoft - their share price is up, yahoos is down. > A years time they can walk in and do a hostile takeover at half the > price. Actually MSFT is flat, Yahoo!'s price is back to a little above where it was before the bid speculation (probably there because there is some residual speculation along your line of thinking). Yahoo! developed an interesting poison pill in the shape of co-operating with Google during the negotiations. Yahoo is "safe" from a hostile MSFT bid in the medium term. Yang can make Yahoo! worthless to a hostile MSFT while enhancing its value to other bidders (not that there are many who can both afford it and need it). I think Yahoo has left egg on MSFT's face. That Microsoft's search and on-line presence generally is in such disarray that they felt the need to invest in a crock like Yahoo! to improve it does reflect badly on Ballmer and Microsoft's senior management. There is a lot of in-house talent in that company, yet they have produced nothing much that works on that side of the business after 10 years of trying to. > Doubt it. I think he wants to go. But hey, it is a long time since > microsoft hit a target! That's for sure. If you continue to judge by share price, do inspect the horizontal line that is MSFT since 2001. SignatureTo de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248 > <snip> >> Hardly a fiasco for microsoft - their share price is up, yahoos is down. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > there are many who can both afford it and need it). I think Yahoo has > left egg on MSFT's face. I think the bid a desperate bid to do *something*. It would have been a disaster for everyone involved as the two companies have opposing views wrt software development. Yahoo is very much as open source shop which shares a lot of it's code with the community and their back-end systems are (from what I've read) very non-MS. Therefore, MS would either have had to rip out the core of Yahoo from the inside out or lived with the fact that one of their divisions was very much non-MS. Neither option would have been satisfactory. > I think the bid a desperate bid to do *something*. It would have been a > disaster for everyone involved as the two companies have opposing views [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > fact that one of their divisions was very much non-MS. Neither option > would have been satisfactory. And you can guess which it would be from looking at the history of Hotmail. (and more amusingly, the trouble MS had to get it ported to Windows.) Signature"Be thankful that you have a life, and forsake your vain and presumptuous desire for a second one." [email me at huge {at} huge (dot) org <dot> uk] [snip] > Doubt it. I think he wants to go. But hey, it is a long time since > microsoft hit a target! <puzzled> But MS has been maintaining the bullseye target hit that it achieved in the 1980s - and they've kept on that tightrope (to mix up the metaphors) for two decades, give or take. Rowland. SignatureRemove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell@dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking > [snip] > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the 1980s - and they've kept on that tightrope (to mix up the metaphors) > for two decades, give or take. I meant like a deadline target, which micrsoft have not managed to hit since the late 90s. SignatureWoody www.alienrat.com > > [snip] > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Don't you believe it. I have no beliefs. But if you think that I think Billg has nothing to do with running MS, you're crazy. > I know he's supposed to be handing his keys over > fully somewhere in 2009, but with the recent Yahoo! fiasco I have to > wonder if he's thinking "Balmer's not up to it" and may hang around a > wee bit longer. I always thought Ballmer was planted in that post by iSteve, 'cos he's just a complete and utter w.nker without a clue. Rowland. SignatureRemove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell@dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking > > > > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. > > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I have no beliefs. But if you think that I think Billg has nothing to > do with running MS, you're crazy. Okay, that statement need clarifying slightly - am I to assume you mean that BillG isn't running MS, but does still have _something_ to do with running it? In which case I'd agree. If not, please explain, because you appear to be contradicting yourself. > > I know he's supposed to be handing his keys over > > fully somewhere in 2009, but with the recent Yahoo! fiasco I have to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I always thought Ballmer was planted in that post by iSteve, 'cos he's > just a complete and utter w.nker without a clue. That makes as much sense as any other explanation. Jim Signature'Cloverfield' in nine words: "What is it?!" "We're gonna die!" BOOM! Roll credits. Find me at http://www.ursaminorbeta.co.uk > > > > > Bill may be a total git, but he's not stupid. > > > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > that BillG isn't running MS, but does still have _something_ to do with > running it? In which case I'd agree. Obviously - he is a major shareholder. SignatureWoody www.alienrat.com > > Okay, that statement need clarifying slightly - am I to assume you mean > > that BillG isn't running MS, but does still have _something_ to do with > > running it? In which case I'd agree. > > Obviously - he is a major shareholder. Ha. Yes, fair point. Jim Signature'Cloverfield' in nine words: "What is it?!" "We're gonna die!" BOOM! Roll credits. Find me at http://www.ursaminorbeta.co.uk > Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I > wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( I spent around 6 hours installing XP and getting Bluetooth to work on my Eee. It seems that Windows wouldn't recognise my BT 'dongle' - which is odd, 'cos OSX picked up on it straight away, without needing to install a driver. SignatureSteveH 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo' www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - Hongdou GY200 - Alfa 75 TSpark Alfa 156 TSpark - B6 Passat 2.0TDI SE - COSOC KOTL BOTAFOT #87 - BOTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC # > 19:00 today: finally got it into a usable state. XP Pro updated as far as it > will go, Office 2007 installed and upgraded, Project and Visio installed, > Skype installed, Outlook linked to the Exchange server. > > That's it... a full working day to get a computer into a state where I can > *start* using it! Incredible... How much of that was getting XP fully updated? I know from personal experience that that can take a couple of hours by itself, depending on the speed of your broadband. SP3 is supposed to alleviate this to some extent. They've just released it. Again. Jim Signature'Cloverfield' in nine words: "What is it?!" "We're gonna die!" BOOM! Roll credits. Find me at http://www.ursaminorbeta.co.uk On Thu, 8 May 2008 06:10:28 +0100, Jim wrote >> 19:00 today: finally got it into a usable state. XP Pro updated as far as it >> will go, Office 2007 installed and upgraded, Project and Visio installed, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > SP3 is supposed to alleviate this to some extent. They've just released > it. Again. SP3 was about 90mb and took a few minutes to download. There were then a few dozen additional updates needed - including two further reboots to get XP up to date. Office update took about another 30 minutes, with a further reboot > Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > and silver case. Cute little 'mini-keyboard', 4gb RAM and 250gb HDD - and all > for £400. So, what was the total cost when you add in your time etc? Even on minimum wage it adds another 50 quid or so; I would hope you're worth a little more. On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:23:24 +0100, David Kennedy wrote >> Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> That aside, it's got a nice 20" Dell screen and a horrible 'faux-Apple' >> white and silver case. Cute little 'mini-keyboard', 4gb RAM and 250gb HDD - and >> all for £400. > > So, what was the total cost when you add in your time etc? Even on > minimum wage it adds another 50 quid or so; I would hope you're worth a > little more. Well, I'm retired now so would happily argue that my time is worthless = £400 cost. I still do some bits of consulting for a few specific organisations where I usually bill at £250/hr so cost could = £2,500 cost. It doesn't really bother me to be honest. It's not about the money... The point is, until MS provide a 100% port of project and visio to OSX, there's no alternative for those who want/need to use those products. > On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:23:24 +0100, David Kennedy wrote >>> Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > usually bill at £250/hr so cost could = £2,500 cost. It doesn't really > bother me to be honest. It's not about the money... That's fair comment but there are lots for whom cost is important and they argue that the Dell _is_ a bargain at 400 quid forgetting the fact that it took at least a full day to set up. > The point is, until MS provide a 100% port of project and visio to OSX, > there's no alternative for those who want/need to use those products. Does anyone actually want to use them? > > On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:23:24 +0100, David Kennedy wrote > >>> Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > Does anyone actually want to use them? There are two parts to the answer. If you want fairly capable project management, then Omniplan is not too shabby. Likewise, Omnigraffle is a diagramming tool that makes most, but not all of Visio look sick. Each sort-of interworks with their MS counterparts. The second part of the answer is to forget the first part if you need to work daily with others using the MS ugliness. SignatureTo de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248 On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:59:53 +0100, David Kennedy wrote >> On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:23:24 +0100, David Kennedy wrote >>>> Took delivery of a new Dell Uninspiron PC for the office yesterday. [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > they argue that the Dell _is_ a bargain at 400 quid forgetting the fact > that it took at least a full day to set up. Agreed... but I was talking about me, on a specific day >> The point is, until MS provide a 100% port of project and visio to OSX, >> there's no alternative for those who want/need to use those products. > > Does anyone actually want to use them? If you need absolute, guaranteed 100% compatibility with Project and Visio then nothing else will do. In this case 100% compatibility means - a client sends me a Visio drawing or a Project project (!), I can twiddle with it and send it back to them and it will look absolutely correct when they look at it. Omnigraffle and Omniplan are great within themselves but they don't provide that 100% compatibility. >On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:59:53 +0100, David Kennedy wrote >>> On Thu, 8 May 2008 07:23:24 +0100, David Kennedy wrote [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] >Omnigraffle and Omniplan are great within themselves but they don't provide >that 100% compatibility. Crossover? ... hold on... Yes, according to http://www.codeweavers.com/products/cxmac/ it "officially supports" (whatever that means to you) Visio and Outhouse and Pojectilevomit. It also supports MessyOrifice 2002 (XP) , 2003, 2000 and 97. http://www.codeweavers.com/compatibility/browse/cat/?cat_id=43 Chances are 2007 will run under Crossover, but I'd guess there are issues. I'll try it someday. Or not... http://www.codeweavers.com/compatibility/browse/cat/?showall=1;cat_id=43 Suggests it would not be wise to try 2007. Pity. Just for laughs, I might try it anyway. J. > If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I > wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( YOu could have run them in a VM on the Mac and you wouldn't have needed to buy it. You'd still have had to set up the Windows in the VM of course, but once done you could have cloned it for future use so you didn't have to spend another 10 hours when it went pear shaped. Ian SignatureIan Robinson, Belfast, UK <http://www.canicula.com/wp/> On Thu, 8 May 2008 08:44:09 +0100, Ian Robinson wrote >> If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I >> wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( > > YOu could have run them in a VM on the Mac and you wouldn't have needed to > buy it. You'd still have had to set up the Windows in the VM of course, but > once done you could have cloned it for future use so you didn't have to spend > another 10 hours when it went pear shaped. <shudder> I like to keep Windows WELL away from my Macs - hence the standlone Windows machine for when I need it >On Thu, 8 May 2008 08:44:09 +0100, Ian Robinson wrote >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] ><shudder> I like to keep Windows WELL away from my Macs - hence the >standlone Windows machine for when I need it It's still safer doing it in a VM. Snapshots and rolling back to backup take minutes, rather than another full day - which means every time Windows karks itself, you only spend minutes fixing it. Run it up as a Linux box with VMware Server on. Cheers - Jaimie Signature"I believe every human has a finite number of heartbeats. I don't intend to waste any of mine running around doing exercises." - Neil Armstrong >> If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I >> wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > once done you could have cloned it for future use so you didn't have to spend > another 10 hours when it went pear shaped. That's what I do. VMWare Fusion for Project and Outlook. Works a treat. The only problem is you still need a copy of Windows, so Bill gets his shilling..... > That aside, it's got a nice 20" Dell screen and a horrible 'faux-Apple' white > and silver case. Cute little 'mini-keyboard', 4gb RAM and 250gb HDD - and all > for £400. Why did your company waste money on 4GB of ram? XP (or Vista, for that matter) can't use it. It will handle 3.something GB with some heavy persuasion, but 4GB is wasted. Or are you sitting one ring closer to satan, and using the 64-bit version? Cheers, Signaturejames dore IT Officer, New College, Oxford http://www.new.ox.ac.uk/ it-support@new.... On Thu, 8 May 2008 10:02:05 +0100, James Dore wrote > >> That aside, it's got a nice 20" Dell screen and a horrible 'faux-Apple' [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > matter) can't use it. It will handle 3.something GB with some heavy > persuasion, but 4GB is wasted. It's not my company; it's me. I sold my company a year or so back and retired. 4gb was an extra few quid over 2gb - hardly worth worrying about. > If *only* there was a 100% compatible MS Project and MS Visio on OSX, I > wouldn't have needed to have bought the bloody thing at all :-( For Vision I don't know, but for MS project I use the german-developed Merlin, which I find very efficient. It is compatible up to and including the 'fossil' version of MSproject files that some are using in my office (.mpp files) HTH, SignatureFrédérique & Hervé Sainct, h.sainct@laposte.net [fr,es,en,it] Frédérique's initial is missing in front of the above address l'initiale de Frédérique manque devant l'adresse email ci-dessus |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.