Mac Forum / General / Networking / November 2005

* Hello...
*
* I have two purple iMacs (G3), one is mine on System 9 and the other is
* my parents on System 9.2.
*
* I need to upgrade to System X for both (eventually). I have the original
* System CD for my 9.0 but not for the other 9.2. Would I need to have the
* original CD for an upgrade, or... would I have to "buy" the whole
* systemX package for both ($150)??

There is no 'upgrade' price for OS X. You could probably save a little bit
of money by purchasing the 'family pack' license instead of individual
licenses for each computer.

* Would I have to upgrade in sequence first, such as upgrading to 9.3
* first, before I ever get to sys X? Does this upgrading need to be
* "backed up" first, or does it install saving the original data?

No. In addition, there's no such thing as System 9.3.

* Also have an old SiQuest external drive with allot of stuff on it I'd
* love to transfer to the newer iMacs (as well as use for backup when
* upgrading). Would an adaptor set of wires work (from SCSI to USB
* adaptor) and launch the SiQuest onto the new machines?

SyQuest? I have no idea if those drives would work under OS X. My advice
would be to get a USB pocket drive and use that as a backup device. It'll be
really slow, but it'll be better than the SyQuest. Of course, if your iMacs
have Firewire (which they probably don't, but it's worth looking into), then
Firewire drives would be much faster than USB drives.

* One more thing... how much memory would I need to run the new sys X
* smooothly.

My personal recommendation is that a gigabyte of RAM is a useful starting
point for 10.4 Tiger.

p

I'd put 'em both on 9.2.2, but that's me.

You don't need a 9.x CD to move to 9.2.2. The OS X 10.0.x CD which came with
the iMac will work with any iMac. You can't just upgrade from 10.0.x to 10.1
or higher, you have to buy it.

Delete the quotes. You have to buy the upgrade CD. If I were you I'd get the
family pack, that can legally upgrade up to five machines, and costs $200.

no such animal as OS 9.3.

so long as you're at at least 9.1, OS X doesn't care. 9.2.2 is better, but
there are free updaters for 9.0.x to 9.1 and 9.1 to 9.2 available on Apple's
site.

If you don't back up first and something goes wrong you'll be sorry.

SyPests were a pain when they were new. They were never reliable. Ditch them
and get something reliable. There's nothing worse than an unreliable backup
system.

Depends. 10.0.x isn't ready for prime time, don't use it. 10.1.x will work
with 192MB, will work better with 256 or more. 10.2.x will work with 224,
will work better with 320 or more. 10.3.x and later really need at least 384,
and do better with 512 or more. I'd just max the RAM on the iMacs and have
done with it.

[Note followups to comp.sys.mac.system only]

Which model, exactly?  My interpretation of "Purple" is "Grape", one of
the five colours available in the 266, 333 and 400 MHz iMac models,
which were released in 1999.

There are rather major differences between the 266/333 MHz models (with
a tray-loading CD-ROM drive) and the 400 MHz model (with slot-loading
DVD-ROM drive).

As others have noted, you can update from 9.0 to 9.2.2 with free
downloads from Apple.  There is no "upgrade" price for going to Mac OS X
- you have to pay full price, but the family pack would save you money
if you want to run Mac OS X on at least two computers.

If you have one of the "tray loading CD-ROM" iMac models (266 or 333
MHz), there are several major problems with upgrading to Mac OS X.

1. These models have no Firewire port, hence they are not supported by
the current version of Mac OS X (10.4, "Tiger").  If you were to run Mac
OS X on them, you would have to acquire an older version, and Apple
doesn't sell older versions any more, so you would need to find another
(legal) source.  The last version supported by these models is 10.3.x.

2. The maximum amount of memory supported by these models is 512 MB,
which is sufficient to run Mac OS X, but only just.  Upgrading memory in
these models is difficult, as it involves dismantling a fair amount of
the computer.

3. In order to install Mac OS X you will need a lot of free disk space
(at least 3 GB free to install Mac OS X 10.2 or 10.3).  The largest hard
drive supplied with this iMac model was 6 GB, so you will almost
certainly need to upgrade to a larger hard drive.  Using an external
drive as the main drive isn't practical with these models, because they
only have USB 1.1, which is too slow for regular use, and cannot be used
to boot the computer.

4. Mac OS X will be rather slow on these models.

For all these reasons, it might be a better idea to consider replacing
the computer with a newer model, rather than having to spend a lot of
money upgrading a legacy machine.

If you have the "slot loading DVD-ROM" iMac models (400 MHz), the scope
of the problem is considerably smaller: memory and hard drive are the
only likely problems.  You have a Firewire port and DVD-ROM drive, so
you are able to run Mac OS X 10.4.  Maximum memory is 1 GB, and it is
much easier to upgrade than in the earlier models.  The hard drive
supplied with the computer was 10 GB.  The computer is faster, so Mac OS
X will be more usable.

You should update to Mac OS 9.2.2 (or at least 9.1) before attempting to
install Mac OS X.

A backup is a good idea anyway, in case something goes wrong.  You can
install Mac OS X without wiping the hard drive (and that is the
default), but it does have an option to completely erase the hard drive
before doing an installation.

It is also important to check that you are running the latest firmware
version.  There were serious compatibility issues between some Mac OS X
versions and some iMac models if the firmware hadn't been updated.

The firmware updater was included on the Mac OS X installation CD around
10.2, but I haven't gone looking for it recently.  (You have to run it
manually, while booted from the hard drive running a suitable version of
Mac OS 9.)

You can find out which firmware version you have by running Apple System
Profiler.  The 266/333 MHz model should be firmware 1.2, the 400 MHz
model should be 4.1.9 (both may have extra letters and digits after it,
such as "f" and a number).

If in doubt, you can download the firwmare updaters directly from Apple.

The 266/333 MHz model's firmware update is here:

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=60384

The 400 MHz model's firmware update is here:

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75130

That is possible in theory.  There are USB-to-SCSI and Firewire-to-SCSI
adapters, but the cost may not be worth it if you only want it on a
short term basis.

In any case, I would recommend finding a more suitable backup device for
use with the iMac, as the SyQuest is very old and in my experience it
was never very reliable.  I wouldn't trust it for a single backup.

If your iMac only has USB (266/333 MHz) then your choices are limited,
due to the slow speed of the interface.  Something like a Zip drive
might be OK.  You can use a CD writer, but it will be limited to
transferring data at 4x (or possibly 2x).  An external hard drive is
also an option, but it can't be used to boot the computer, and will also
be very slow due to the USB port.

If you have a Firewire port (400 MHz model) then an external hard drive
is a much better option, as it will be able to run at full speed and can
be used to boot the computer.

I see from a later message that your primary interest in the SyQuest is
doing a one-off transfer of old data.  The best solution I can think of
would be to borrow or otherwise acquire an older Mac model which has
both a SCSI port and an Ethernet port, connect the SyQuest, and use file
sharing to transfer the files over to the new computer via Ethernet.
What model Mac was it being used on originally, and do you still have
that computer?

In general, the best answer is "as much as you can afford and the
computer will support".

I'd recommand 512 MB as a reasonable minimum.  I've tried 128, 192, 256
and 384 in various machines and OS versions, and none were good enough.
I have 768 MB in my PowerBook (running 10.4).

This assumes you aren't running memory hungry applications (e.g. video,
photo or audio editing).  In these cases, you want as much RAM as
possible.