Panther Disk One Failure

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Philip Meech - 18 Feb 2005 18:44 GMT

My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
have since returned to Jag 10.2.8. Any body have any ideas about what is
happening?

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matt neuburg - 18 Feb 2005 19:10 GMT

> My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
> ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
> have since returned to Jag 10.2.8. Any body have any ideas about what is
> happening?

What machine are you running? Any chance it might be bad RAM? m.

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Dave Hinz - 18 Feb 2005 20:03 GMT

>> My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
>> ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
>> have since returned to Jag 10.2.8. Any body have any ideas about what is
>> happening?
>
> What machine are you running? Any chance it might be bad RAM? m.

The latter is an interesting question - what are you thinking it
might be, Matt?

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matt neuburg - 18 Feb 2005 21:48 GMT

> >> My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
> >> ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> The latter is an interesting question - what are you thinking it
> might be, Matt?

I've no idea, really, but we just had a thread where someone said he had
trouble with the installation process and it turned out to be bad RAM,
and we have reason to think that Panther stresses your RAM more than
Jaguar (and you're running Panther when you do the Panther install). The
fact that the installation breaks down at exactly the same point with
two different disks suggests that the problem is internal to the
machine. However, I'd still like to hear more about the specs on this
machine. m.

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Orchid - 19 Feb 2005 03:55 GMT

> > >> My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
> > >> ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> machine. However, I'd still like to hear more about the specs on this
> machine. m.

FWIW, I had a similar experience with bad RAM. That is, installation
failed at exactly the same point each time (and I have two versions of
Panther as well - a Mac Mini install and a commercial release). After I
swapped back to the original 256 MB chip, all went smoothly.

However, I wonder if the original poster's problem may be related to the
CD-ROM drive (being unable to access certain portions of a CD, perhaps).

Orchid

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Philip Meech - 20 Feb 2005 20:48 GMT

My dog hit the CD tray (under the desk) pretty soundly. I had to bend it
back. How would I test the CD
read?

>>>>>My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
>>>>>ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> Orchid

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matt neuburg - 20 Feb 2005 21:57 GMT

> My dog hit the CD tray (under the desk) pretty soundly. I had to bend it
> back. How would I test the CD
> read?

It took a long time into this thread for you to admit this (possibly
crucial) information... :)) m.

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Philip Meech - 21 Feb 2005 01:14 GMT

It happened several weeks before and the CD seemed to be working
normally with music CDs and Itunes.

>>My dog hit the CD tray (under the desk) pretty soundly. I had to bend it
>>back. How would I test the CD
>>read?
>
> It took a long time into this thread for you to admit this (possibly
> crucial) information... :)) m.

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Mike Rosenberg - 21 Feb 2005 14:02 GMT

> It happened several weeks before and the CD seemed to be working
> normally with music CDs and Itunes.

Since your Panther CD fails after 97%, it appears your mechanism is okay
until it reaches the outer edge. Odds are none of your music CDs were
quite that full.

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Mike Rosenberg - 21 Feb 2005 14:02 GMT

> My dog hit the CD tray (under the desk) pretty soundly. I had to bend it
> back. How would I test the CD read?

This sheds new light on the verification failure you've had while
attempting to install Panther. In doing the verification, you've tested
the drive and it's failed.

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Mike Rosenberg
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Philip Meech - 22 Feb 2005 04:23 GMT

I have an external Kangaroo CD burner. Could I verify the install disk
in that, somehow?
Jaguar doesn't let you startup from an external drive, right? Thanks for
your help.

>>My dog hit the CD tray (under the desk) pretty soundly. I had to bend it
>>back. How would I test the CD read?
>
> This sheds new light on the verification failure you've had while
> attempting to install Panther. In doing the verification, you've tested
> the drive and it's failed.

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Neill Massello - 22 Feb 2005 04:43 GMT

> I have an external Kangaroo CD burner. Could I verify the install disk in
> that, somehow? Jaguar doesn't let you startup from an external drive,
> right?

Put the installer CD in the external drive. Start the Mac and hold down
the Option key. Be patient. You should get a blue screen with
(eventually) an icon for the installer CD. Click on the CD icon to
select it, then click on the right arrow to boot the Mac from the CD.

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Mike Rosenberg - 22 Feb 2005 13:02 GMT

> I have an external Kangaroo CD burner. Could I verify the install disk
> in that, somehow?

Sure.

> Jaguar doesn't let you startup from an external drive, right?

The OS has nothing to do with it. If the Mac in question is bootable
from an external drive, it doesn't matter which OS, if any, is currently
installed internally.

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Mike Rosenberg
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Philip Meech - 22 Feb 2005 19:06 GMT

So I put the CD in the external drive and then run disk utility on it?
Norton? Disk Warrior? If it says the disk is screwy then I don't have to
worry about the internal CD? Thanks. I was unable to boot from the
external CD.

>
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
>

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Philip Meech - 25 Feb 2005 03:07 GMT

There is a PCI Card with USB 2.0. That should work.

>
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
>

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Philip Meech - 25 Feb 2005 16:05 GMT

I have the G4/350/18/320 PCI Graphics which does not need the firmware
upgrade. Do you think I accidentally triggered a the wrong firmware
upgrade ?

I have examined a possible CD drive failure, hard drive problems, done
the clean install without zeroing the HD. At this point I am leaning
towards the highly improbable possibility that I got two bad disks in a
row.

The Emac Disk that I have is showing an unfixable Header problem in both
Norton and Disk Utility. Even though it successfully installed Panther
the first time. I would prefer to upgrade to Panther and solve the
Shuffle problem that way. I don't understand why they didn't choose
firewire instead of USB 2.0

> There is a PCI Card with USB 2.0. That should work.
>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>>
>>

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Mike Rosenberg - 25 Feb 2005 20:51 GMT

> The Emac Disk that I have is showing an unfixable Header problem in both
> Norton and Disk Utility. Even though it successfully installed Panther
> the first time. I would prefer to upgrade to Panther and solve the
> Shuffle problem that way.

Solve _what_ Shuffle problem? So far you haven't indicated one. As
I've pointed out twice now, the Shuffle works under 10.2.8 with USB 1.1
-- what Apple says is that you may need 10.3.4 or higher for low-POWER
USB ports, meaning a keyboard port or unpowered hub.

> I don't understand why they didn't choose firewire instead of USB 2.0

A lot of computers have USB ports but no FireWire.

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Mike Rosenberg
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Neill Massello - 25 Feb 2005 23:21 GMT

> Solve _what_ Shuffle problem? So far you haven't indicated one.

Mr Meech is starting to look like a troll, dribbling out bits of
information and misinformation to keep a thread going, or like one of
those clueless-aggressive types who are the functional equivalent of
trolls. In any case, his problems can't be fixed with back and forth on
Usenet.

BTW, has anybody else ever seen a CD verification dialog or progress bar
when booting from an OS X installer CD? I've had installer CDs that
wouldn't boot, installers that refused to install on a particular model,
installers that crashed, and installers that mangled the hard drive
volume they installed on; but I've never seen an installer CD that
verified itself, at least in any way visible to the user, during
startup.

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Dave Hinz - 25 Feb 2005 23:23 GMT

>> Solve _what_ Shuffle problem? So far you haven't indicated one.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> trolls. In any case, his problems can't be fixed with back and forth on
> Usenet.

Anyone seen Mark Conrad lately? Has he nym-shifted again maybe?

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Tom Stiller - 25 Feb 2005 23:54 GMT

> >> Solve _what_ Shuffle problem? So far you haven't indicated one.
> >
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Anyone seen Mark Conrad lately? Has he nym-shifted again maybe?
>

He's active in a couple of threads in other groups.

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Dave Hinz - 28 Feb 2005 15:33 GMT

>> >> Solve _what_ Shuffle problem? So far you haven't indicated one.
>> >
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> He's active in a couple of threads in other groups.

Maybe we should introduce him to Phil? They seem like they'd get
along.

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Mike Rosenberg - 25 Feb 2005 23:39 GMT

> BTW, has anybody else ever seen a CD verification dialog or progress bar
> when booting from an OS X installer CD? I've had installer CDs that
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> verified itself, at least in any way visible to the user, during
> startup.

He's not making this up. Take another look when you get a chance. When
you do a Panther installation, after you've booted and have gone through
all of the dialogs to begin the actual installation, the first thing you
see is progress bar indicating the CD is, indeed, being verified.

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Mike Rosenberg
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Philip Meech - 26 Feb 2005 02:43 GMT

Thank you. I happen to run a company called Macintosh Consulting
Services in Buffalo. I thought that this might be a good forum for a
particularly thorny problem.
There is far too much argument ad hominem going on.

>
>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
>

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Dave Hinz - 28 Feb 2005 15:32 GMT

> Thank you. I happen to run a company called Macintosh Consulting
> Services in Buffalo. I thought that this might be a good forum for a
> particularly thorny problem.
> There is far too much argument ad hominem going on.

Not to mention top-posting.

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Neill Massello - 26 Feb 2005 08:58 GMT

> He's not making this up. Take another look when you get a chance. When
> you do a Panther installation, after you've booted and have gone through
> all of the dialogs to begin the actual installation, the first thing you
> see is progress bar indicating the CD is, indeed, being verified.

OK, I misunderstood at what point in the process the verfication error
was occurring.

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Neill Massello - 18 Feb 2005 22:47 GMT

Do you mean that hard disk verification fails? What is the wording of
the error message?

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Philip Meech - 19 Feb 2005 02:35 GMT

That would be the startup install CD that fails. Message is continue
anyway, try again, or quit installer.

>>My disk 1 goes to 97% verification and then gives an error message. I
>>ordered a second disk from MacConnection and it did the same thing. I
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Do you mean that hard disk verification fails? What is the wording of
> the error message?

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matt neuburg - 19 Feb 2005 14:48 GMT

> That would be the startup install CD that fails. Message is continue
> anyway, try again, or quit installer.
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> > Do you mean that hard disk verification fails? What is the wording of
> > the error message?

You didn't really answer the question (Neill wanted to know what was
being verified), but here are two suggestions: (1) Run DiskWarrior on
your computer before doing anything else, and (2) If the installer
offers a chance to "continue anyway", continue anyway and see what
happens. Also, perform a clean installation (archive and install), not
an upgrade installation. m.

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Philip Meech - 19 Feb 2005 02:33 GMT

G4/18/350 PCI/320 ram No new ram. First install of panther ran perfectly
for two months until I unstuffed
a file in the system library that was sifd.sitx or something close.
After that flashing question mark. I initialized the hard drive and
reinstalled Jaguar after I could not reinstall from two Disk1s. The
error message from the startup CD was
the continue or quit message when verification fails. I tried both
alternative before and after the new install, but I still get the 97%
fail message.

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Mac Forum / Applications / Mac Applications / February 2005

Panther Disk One Failure