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Mac Forum / Applications / Mac Applications / February 2005



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How to create another admin user in OS X

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Jeff Wiseman - 16 Feb 2005 21:36 GMT
I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
I log in as the admin user and then from the System Preferences
panel for accounts, select my account and click the "+", it
always creates a standard user.

What am I missing?

- Jeff
Dave Hinz - 16 Feb 2005 21:40 GMT
> I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
> user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
> I log in as the admin user and then from the System Preferences
> panel for accounts, select my account and click the "+", it
> always creates a standard user.

It's there, advanced tab or something, but why would you not keep _the_
admin account separate?  It's just for admin tasks, each individual
should have their own personal, non-admin account for daily work.

> What am I missing?

There's another screen you can get to from the "set up my user's
account" screen, but I'm not in front of a Mac at the moment.
AES - 17 Feb 2005 00:44 GMT
> > I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
> > user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> admin account separate?  It's just for admin tasks, each individual
> should have their own personal, non-admin account for daily work.

Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
"admin user" who is not also, inevitably, an "individual" or "standard"
user"?

Phrasing this another way:  Could the basic structure be described as,
"There are always one or more users, at least one of whom (and sometimes
more than one of whom) must always have administrative privileges"?
Neill Massello - 17 Feb 2005 01:14 GMT
> Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
> account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
> "admin user" who is not also, inevitably, an "individual" or "standard"
> user"?

AFAIK, the only thing that distinguishes an admin account from any other
kind of account is that it's a member of the admin group. It's that
group membership that confers the power "to administer this computer".
Jeff Wiseman - 17 Feb 2005 07:46 GMT
>>Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
>>account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> kind of account is that it's a member of the admin group. It's that
> group membership that confers the power "to administer this computer".

Actually, it is more than that. There is a subset of userID
number values on the system (a range of values, actually), that
have some extra powers, at least at the UNIX level. Although a
lot comes from membership in the admin group, there are certain
extra priviledges to being an admin.

- Jeff
Neill Massello - 17 Feb 2005 08:25 GMT
> Actually, it is more than that. There is a subset of userID
> number values on the system (a range of values, actually), that
> have some extra powers, at least at the UNIX level. Although a
> lot comes from membership in the admin group, there are certain
> extra priviledges to being an admin.

The first user-created account in OS X is 501. The second is 502, and so
on, no matter whether the accounts have admin privileges. It does not
appear that there is any special numerical range for admin accounts. OS
X does not, by default, make admin users members of the staff or wheel
groups, but does add them to the appserverad group.

The only other attribute (in my very limited knowledge) relevant to
admin status is the sudoer designation. My sudoers file lists only one
user (root) and the admin group. However other UNIX systems may do it,
it looks like OS X simply piggybacks admin privileges on group
membership.
Jeff Wiseman - 17 Feb 2005 17:35 GMT
>>Actually, it is more than that. There is a subset of userID
>>number values on the system (a range of values, actually), that
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> X does not, by default, make admin users members of the staff or wheel
> groups, but does add them to the appserverad group.

Thanks for correcting me on that. I've used many Unix systems but
I'm still quite new to Darwin.

> The only other attribute (in my very limited knowledge) relevant to
> admin status is the sudoer designation. My sudoers file lists only one
> user (root) and the admin group. However other UNIX systems may do it,
> it looks like OS X simply piggybacks admin privileges on group
> membership.

Good information to know (at least for myself).

- Jeff
Dave Seaman - 17 Feb 2005 08:37 GMT
>>>Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
>>>account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>> kind of account is that it's a member of the admin group. It's that
>> group membership that confers the power "to administer this computer".

> Actually, it is more than that. There is a subset of userID
> number values on the system (a range of values, actually), that
> have some extra powers, at least at the UNIX level. Although a
> lot comes from membership in the admin group, there are certain
> extra priviledges to being an admin.

I doubt that.  The first account created on a new Mac is assigned uid
501, and it's an administrator.  Subsequent accounts get consecutive
numbers.  Enabling or disabling admin status for an account does not
change its uid.

My account has a higher uid than the one originally assigned, for
purposes of NFS compatibility with other machines on the network.  It
doesn't affect my admin status.  

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Dave Seaman
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Dave Seaman - 17 Feb 2005 02:27 GMT
>> > I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
>> > user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>> admin account separate?  It's just for admin tasks, each individual
>> should have their own personal, non-admin account for daily work.

> Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
> account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
> "admin user" who is not also, inevitably, an "individual" or "standard"
> user"?

Any member of group "admin" is an administrator.

> Phrasing this another way:  Could the basic structure be described as,
> "There are always one or more users, at least one of whom (and sometimes
> more than one of whom) must always have administrative privileges"?

When you boot a Mac for the very first time, you are asked for a user ID
and password that will be used to create the first account, which is
always an admin account.

In order to add or delete accounts (admin or not) you must be logged in
as an admin user.  However, you cannot delete the account of any user who
is currently logged in.  Therefore, it is not possible to delete all the
admin accounts.

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Dave Seaman
Judge Yohn's mistakes revealed in Mumia Abu-Jamal ruling.
<http://www.commoncouragepress.com/index.cfm?action=book&bookid=228>

Tom Harrington - 17 Feb 2005 03:54 GMT
> In order to add or delete accounts (admin or not) you must be logged in
> as an admin user.  However, you cannot delete the account of any user who
> is currently logged in.  Therefore, it is not possible to delete all the
> admin accounts.

If you're logged in as an admin account, you can revoke your own admin
status.  So while you might not be able to delete all the admin
accounts, you could effectively remove all users from admin status.

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Tom "Tom" Harrington
Macaroni, Automated System Maintenance for Mac OS X.
Version 2.0:  Delocalize, Repair Permissions, lots more.
See http://www.atomicbird.com/

Jeff Wiseman - 17 Feb 2005 08:00 GMT
>>In order to add or delete accounts (admin or not) you must be logged in
>>as an admin user.  However, you cannot delete the account of any user who
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> status.  So while you might not be able to delete all the admin
> accounts, you could effectively remove all users from admin status.

Interesting isn't it! Have you tried this??  :-)

Actually, the system won't let you delete your' priviledges as an
admin if there are no others around. Try it! On a system with a
single admin account, go into it and try to remove the
priviledges. It won't let you. But create a second account with
admin priviledges and all of a sudden the priviledge box for your
original account is no longer greyed out. If you go and login to
the other new admin account, go to the security pane and turn off
its admin priviledge. now go back to the original admin account
and see that the priviledge check box is once again greyed out.

Now technically you can enable superuser, log into root, and kill
the last admin account but then you couldn't disable the
superuser account.

It's lonely at the top. You can't even commit suicide  :-)

- Jeff

P.S. can you imagine all the original UNIX testing that went on
to ensure all permutations of these types of things were covered?
Wayne C. Morris - 17 Feb 2005 08:05 GMT
> > In order to add or delete accounts (admin or not) you must be logged in
> > as an admin user.

Wrong.  You need to know an admin's name & password so you can authenticate
when you click on the lock icon, but you don't have to be logged in as an
admin.

You also need sufficient access to run System Preferences and open the
Accounts pane; it's possible to control which non-admin users are allowed
to do that.

> > However, you cannot delete the account of any user who is currently
> > logged in.  Therefore, it is not possible to delete all the admin
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> status.  So while you might not be able to delete all the admin
> accounts, you could effectively remove all users from admin status.

No, you can't.  If there's only one admin account, the admin option for
that account is greyed out; you can't turn it off.  OS X forces you to
always have at least one working admin account.  If you want to revoke the
admin status of the only admin, you must first make someone else an admin.
Jeff Wiseman - 17 Feb 2005 07:42 GMT
> Question (for info purposes):  Is there such a thing as an "admin
> account" that is fundamentally different from a "user account"? Or an
> "admin user" who is not also, inevitably, an "individual" or "standard"
> user"?

Taking from my old unix days--All accounts are really "user
accounts". An Admin account is a special type of user account. In
addition to belonging to the "admin" group, it has some of the
administrative powers of a superuser (e.g., the ability to change
other people's passwords even if they have nothing to do with the
admin group.

Some types of unix services actually have their own accounts as
well but nobody actually logs into them. They are for processes
that are set up so that if something goes nuts or is hijacked,
other processes in the system are protected from them.

> Phrasing this another way:  Could the basic structure be described as,
> "There are always one or more users, at least one of whom (and sometimes
> more than one of whom) must always have administrative privileges"?

There is always at least one user account and that is the
superuser. However and admin can do nearly anything a superuser
can do only they tendto have to keep entering their password all
the time. Once logged in as superuser, this usually is not
necessary. The superuser account is disabled in OS X but it can
be enabled for certain tasks but most Unix admins will tell you
it is almost always better to have admin account and the sudo
type commands to accoumplich superuser activities than to
actually log in as the superuser.

BTW, i forget the actual values, but superuser is either userID
number 0 or 1. Admins are all users with userIDs that are less
than a certain value (again I forget the value used). Normally in
the Mac you never see the userID number but if you go into the
terminal window and do a long listing on files in your home
directory (e.g., "ls -l") the numberic values for you as a user
(your userID) and your group (your groupID) are visible on each
file. When you do a get info on a file or folder in the finder
and look at the permissions, those numberic values are mapped
into the text values of your account name and group name.

- Jeff
Dave Hinz - 17 Feb 2005 15:16 GMT
>> > I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
>> > user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> "admin user" who is not also, inevitably, an "individual" or "standard"
> user"?

Yes.  The admin account is allowed to interfere with system-level
files, where a "joe user" account can only break their own stuff.

> Phrasing this another way:  Could the basic structure be described as,
> "There are always one or more users, at least one of whom (and sometimes
> more than one of whom) must always have administrative privileges"?

Yes, unless you want to run the stock Apple install forever, chances
are you'll need admin rights at some point.  The first account
you create is automatically granted those rights, which are need to
add more accounts and so on.

It's more complicated than that, but this is fundamentally accurate.

Dave Hinz
matt neuburg - 16 Feb 2005 21:45 GMT
> I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
> user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> What am I missing?

The Security pane and the "Allow user to administer this computer"
checkbox.

m.

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Marc Heusser - 16 Feb 2005 22:53 GMT
> I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
> user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> - Jeff

Tab Security>Allow user to administer this computer.

HTH

MArc
Ernie Klein - 16 Feb 2005 23:17 GMT
> I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin
> user and 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> - Jeff

System Preferences -> Accounts

Highlight the account and click on security.  Check the "Allow user to
administer this computer" box.

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-Ernie-

"There are only two kinds of computer users -- those who have
suffered a catastrophic hard drive failure, and those who will."

            Have you done your backup today?

Jeff Wiseman - 17 Feb 2005 07:27 GMT
> I have a G5 with OS 10.3.6 on it. I have provisioned one admin user and
> 3 standard users. How do I create another admin user? If I log in as the
> admin user and then from the System Preferences panel for accounts,
> select my account and click the "+", it always creates a standard user.
>
> What am I missing?

Thanks all! Several folks pointed out the security pane.

The thing that threw me was originally when I only had a single
admin account on the system, selecting the "+" for a new account
automatically made it an admin account. once you create a
standard account, you have to create a new standard account and
then edit it to give it admin priviledges.

- Jeff
 
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